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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens Site News
Apple introduced new MacBook and MacBook Pro models today, which both look terrific to me, save one glaring (couldn't resist!) mistake: the glossy-only screens. It's no secret that I'm not a big fan of glossy screens on laptops, and the fact that I can't get a matte screen on the new MacBook Pros means, quite simply, I won't be buying myself a new MBP.

But I'm curious what others think, hence, I just posted this new poll on that very subject. Basically, how will the lack of a matte screen option affect (or not affect) your MacBook Pro (or even MacBook) purchase plans?

Obviously, you know where my vote went...but what about you? Is the glossy-only screen a deal breaker or not?
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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens | 32 comments | Create New Account
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glaring omission
Authored by: wgscott on Oct 14, '08 05:42:27PM

I've been using the grey "blackboard" theme from Keynote as a Desktop image, and it cuts down on the glare quite a lot. I too hate the new glossy screens.



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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens
Authored by: captain lolpants on Oct 14, '08 05:47:52PM

Actually, no, we don't know where your vote went.

You start by stating that you're NOT a fan of matte screens on laptops. Then you state that because you can not get 'one' ('one' being a reference to the matte display, which you're not a fan of) on the MBP, you won't be buying one.

Conversely, because you are a fan of glossy screens on laptops, you won't be buying a MBP because you *can* get one.



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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens
Authored by: robg on Oct 14, '08 08:09:34PM

Sigh. Wrote that *way* too fast. Hopefully it's clearer now :)

-rob.



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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens
Authored by: Auricchio on Oct 14, '08 05:48:20PM

I think you meant to say that either you're not a fan of glossy screens, or that you prefer matte.

---
EMOJO: mojo no longer workin'



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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens
Authored by: robg on Oct 14, '08 08:08:26PM

Whoops, you're correct. Fixed now :).

thx;
-rob.



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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens
Authored by: acaltabiano on Oct 14, '08 06:40:41PM

I previously had a PowerBook 17" with Matte, now on a MacBook 13" with glossy. I can say this from using both, the Glossy's better in about every aspect, even with respect to glare.

What I found was, the matte finish just makes a big splotch you can't see past. The "glossy" does produce a reflection, but you can move it out of the way or looked passed it. The matte finish's whiteout spot however, cannot be gotten around. What's more, you'd think the matte would fare better outside, but quite the opposite is true.

I dislike the overly-glossy screens found on some PC laptops, but the state of affairs on Apple's portables I think is about the perfect blend.

---
timing has an awful lot to do with the outcome of a raindance
http://www.randombob.net



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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens
Authored by: asmeurer on Oct 14, '08 06:42:22PM

I agree about the glossy screen. If you have any natural light in the room, say from a window or skylight, you have the potential to have the sun projection from that window reflected on your screen. This is also the case for any artificial light in the room, so forget about a desk lamp. I also don't like the new keyboard, which seems easier to clean, but worse for typing (spaces between letters, like one of their extended keyboards, whereas the now old MBP keyboard is very good for typing) and they kept the same layout where in there is not control by the arrows and fn is the leftmost key (horrible for Spaces). The removal of Firewire 400, especially without replacing it with another port, is a downgrade. And I don't like the gap to open the lid instead of the button. A latched closing is much safer, I think.
The new track pad is cool, and I want to check it out.

I wonder if there are non-reflective sheets or something that you can put over the glossy screen to make it better.



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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens
Authored by: Auricchio on Oct 14, '08 09:11:10PM
The removal of Firewire 400, especially without replacing it with another port, is a downgrade.

There are $20 adapters to allow 6-pin FW400 devices to connect to the 9-pin FW800 port. I was worried about this same thing.

---
EMOJO: mojo no longer workin'

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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens
Authored by: Developer Dude on Oct 14, '08 06:46:22PM

The glossy screen is just the nail in the coffin.

At the very least I need Apple to up the maximum RAM config; i.e., I need more than 4 GB of RAM. I also need 4 CPUs or more. Yes, what I do requires a lot of RAM and CPU - especially the RAM.

So these changes are merely cosmetic in my eyes. Until they come out with a 17" MBP with more RAM and preferably more CPUs, I'll work on my MacPro and use my PowerBook for traveling.



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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens
Authored by: kaih on Oct 14, '08 07:45:22PM

Developer Dude, you're doing exactly what Apple intend you to do - use your desktop for tasks that require the grunt and the notebook for tasks that require you to be mobile.

---
k:.



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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens
Authored by: imperialline on Oct 14, '08 07:02:09PM

Glossy screens for me. Having purchased and used a MacBook Pro 17" with a glossy screen for about a year, I would never buy a laptop with a matte screen again.



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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens
Authored by: encro on Oct 15, '08 02:01:20PM

I own a MBP 17 with a HD Glossy screen and agree with you 100%.
The newer screen contrast ratio and brightness make the glossy screen a non-issue.

I think dal20402 put it best on Ars Technica:
"I'm just not sure why *everyone* is convinced that matte is better for photo work. It's not.

If you're in an environment where color is critical, you don't want to have glaring lights no matter what type of display you have.

Realistically, though, you'll always have lights in your room. With a matte display, you will get some glare from the lights, no matter where they are. With a glossy display, you can move the display such that the glare from the lights is virtually eliminated. Once positioned right, the glossy gives you more accurate color.

Further, the glossy is sharper. The antiglare coating on a matte display diffuses pixel edges and causes what looks like pixel bleed. The glossy doesn't have that problem.

Finally, I often hear misguided souls complaining that the glossy is "oversaturated." So calibrate it, which you should be doing anyway if you're a pro. The glossy's expanded gamut is a plus, not a minus.

(Most of the glossy upset seems to surround the laptops... which is funny, because color accuracy on a TN display is impossible anyway, since the colors at the bottom and the top are inconsistent from any viewing angle...)"

---
Steve



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It's not just the screens It's Apple's moves.
Authored by: cycomachead on Oct 14, '08 09:14:46PM

I dislike glossy screens because they can be annoying sometimes. But most of the time I barely notice it and the reflection is actually useful in bright sunlight where matte is just washed out. But I do prefer matte for photo work.
Ok but here's my thing: glass is even more reflective than the MB screen IMO-and that could cause problems.

Also the huge 16" piece of glass is unnecessary!!!!!!! Glass is recyclable, but so is a thin Al bezel. The 15" MBP is actually HEAVIER .1lbs!!!! A think bezel is lighter, allows for a matte display, and is probably cheaper.

Then I don't like the black look. Yes, I know apple wants a unified mac look, but I was also more fond on the what iMacs. I've never been fond of black glass, why not just aluminum and a matte display? Or the option as you could do glass over Al. This would be very is for the iMacs and pretty easy for MB/P.

Personally there are some things I hate. I will not buy the 24" display!!! THERE'S NO FIREWIRE DARN IT!!!!!!!!!!! And the MBPs are missing a port! Still no graphics mem in MB, though an improvement. Also I wonder if the no mouse button will deter people. But I very rarely use mine!

(yes I posted this to the poll as well)



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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens
Authored by: emale on Oct 14, '08 11:14:04PM

What's the big difference between MacBook and MacBookPro? Since there's the MacBook (formerly iBook), there was an optical difference, now it's only the size and the processor speed. For me, the MacBook seems to be dropped and instead of a 13" MacBookPro they call it MacBook.
What about the 17" MacBookPro? Nice that there's just one laptop with matte screen, but that the MacBook looks like the MacBookPro and the 15" MacBookPro looks different than the 17" MacBookPro is very oddly.
Waited months for the new laptops and now I'm just very disappointed about apple.



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Glossy vs Matte Thoughts
Authored by: drmacnut on Oct 15, '08 01:24:21AM

I admit that when I bought my latest MBP 15" this summer, I got the matte screen for fear of the glossy! But since then, I also have been using a September-built iMac 24" with glossy in my office, and to tell you all the truth, I quite like it. I have it hooked up to a brand-new matte 24" Cinema Display right next to the iMac, so I can easily compare. The glossy seems brighter and sharper (I say "seems" as in "appears", not "is" scientifically), and I think now that I would not be too scared to get a glossy new MBP. As Steve Jobs said earlier today in defending the glossy, it's easy to reposition a portable computer.

I got my girlfriend a glossy MacBook earlier this year, and she doesn't even notice the difference between my matte MBP and her MB. Even after I pointed it out to her, she didn't get the difference. In truth, when I use her MB, it doesn't bother me at all; I just sort of "look past" the glare that lights may cause on the screen.

Overall, I trust Apple, Mr. Ive, and Steve's tastes. It's like the lack of FW 400 on the new MBPs: wha?? First reaction: "I need that FW400!!". Then I think back to the days when I said "I need SCSI!" or "I need ADB!". So I guess I need to buy a couple more LaCie Ruggeds with FW400/800 and get on with life.

Finally, it is indeed be true that the MacBook and MacBook Pro are becoming more alike in appearance. Perhaps this is slowly opening the door for something of a new form factor to fill the gap. January 2009 anyone? ;)



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Glass isn't bad
Authored by: gavinsk on Oct 15, '08 03:29:26AM

What someone else said, you have to remember that this is glass, not plastic. Long before LCDs we were working with glass in CRTs and swearing up and down that the CRT superior picture quality would keep CRTs on top. Those CRTs have glass too. This isn't just a plastic glossy coating, this is glass, what we're use to.



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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens
Authored by: Anonymous on Oct 15, '08 03:41:11AM

I too feel that the MBP should have the "option" for matte as well, or maybe someone will come up with a super slick film covering for screen that can stick without bubbles ;-)

I work in Events & Shows and as such in many different lighting environments ie. dark rooms with lots of flashing lights, i have no problem with my MBP but people with Macbooks are always fiddling with screen angle/brightness etc to get a clear view of screen content. It can be very distracting......with all that full on reflection

I am not overall anti glossy as most users don't really care and many users i know forgoed the mac pro option for imac 24s, and they are very happy. But again people do have the option of an external display that is not glossy.....if they do colour based work in a studio etc. Always nice using two screens IMO !

so overall we will have to live with it and get used to those glossy screens.....as a footnote i personally would have bought a new 24inch screen if it was not glossy !



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I also hate there's no button
Authored by: jhewell on Oct 15, '08 03:47:25AM

I always turn off the mouse gestures because I always touch the pad wrong or misplace a finger and off goes the cursor to some other part of the screen, or the scroll kicks in, whatever...

Since now gestures are pretty much standard and required for any mouse movement, I'm not interested in the new MBP AT ALL.




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I also hate there's no button
Authored by: j-beda on Oct 15, '08 06:24:49AM

I think that there is a physical clicking button, it is just the whole trackpad works like that. I'll have to try it out to be sure, but it seems workable.



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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens
Authored by: robogobo on Oct 15, '08 03:58:05AM

Hey Rob, it might be a good idea to disable the comments for either the announcement of the poll, or for the poll itself, as a rule. With some heated topics such as this, the dialog gets way too confusing.

just my 2¢



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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens
Authored by: robg on Oct 15, '08 04:31:53AM

I would if I could, but the ability to disable the comments doesn't work in the version of Geeklog we're currently using :(.

-rob.



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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens
Authored by: Cobalt Jacket on Oct 15, '08 06:44:59AM

Anyone know 1) if the new MB/MBPs use DisplayPort for the internal connector as well? 2) if the new internal displays are 6bit or 8bit per channeL?



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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens
Authored by: Cobalt Jacket on Oct 15, '08 07:15:27AM

One other thing -- has anyone found an adapter to permit use of the new LED Apple Cinema Display on DVI MacBook (Pro) units?



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Re: Don't Like Gestures
Authored by: drmacnut on Oct 15, '08 08:22:57AM

You might need to review your technique of using the trackpad. I think you'll find that a slightly modified technique on your part will yield good results. (That's my tip and hint).

And unfortunately, if you choose not to purchase a new Mac portable of any kind because of "gestures", then take good care of your current Mac, because it's your last.



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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens
Authored by: Kerrstr on Oct 15, '08 08:56:10AM
I purchased a black MacBook this past November (right after Leopard was released), and I have to say... I am extremely happy with it except for the glossy screen. It's a dust magnet, shows every smudge and smear, and the glare (in bright light or sunshine) makes it incredibly hard to see the screen. If you live in a cave, and always have a Swiffer nearby, I'd say "go for it...".

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I use both - it's a toss up
Authored by: lujo on Oct 15, '08 09:01:22AM

I thought there would be a big difference between a matte and glossy screen, so I stayed with the matte screen I liked when I bought my last MBP. Now I use a MacBook at work with its glossy screen side-by-side a matte Cinema Display. In day-to-day usage, I can hardly tell a difference between all the three screens (I have calibrated the screens to be as similar as possible). Based on my experience, it may take a short while to get used to, but I don't think it will really be a long-term issue for anyone considering a new MB or MBP.



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All Glossy Screen Owners love them
Authored by: DevMac on Oct 15, '08 09:39:16AM

Interesting that the only ones that dislike the gloss screens don't own or never owned one. All those that have one, wouldn't change.

One thing that should be considered, the bright LED significantly reduces glare and reflection–not like the old days.



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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens
Authored by: ctierney on Oct 15, '08 09:43:43AM

Funny part is I finally talked my wife into upgrading from her clamshell iBook to a new MBP just last Saturday. It arrived this morning as I was reading the announcement of the newer models.

I also dislike the glossy displays. I'm glad I can put a positive spin on missing the new models by a few days. ;-)

--
Cole



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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens
Authored by: osxpounder on Oct 15, '08 09:54:39AM

Yes, it's a deal-breaker. If the MacBook Pro comes with only a glossy screen, it's off the wish list. I chose my current MacBook Pro *because* it had a matte screen. Primary feature AFAIC.

I may be forced to use one in the future because, let's face it, it's still the best option for some kinds of work (vis á vis Windows or Linux laptops).

I work mostly with graphics and animation programs. I stare at my screens for many, many hours.

Glossy screens make all my work harder to do, and harder to see. It seems glossy screens work best when the room is dark, but that's unhealthy and, anyway, not an option for me at the office cube farm.

Glossy screens tend to cause headaches and eyestrain because we must put extra effort into seeing through the reflections on the screen.

Apple is certainly aware of the 2 facts above. These have been tenets of office ergonomics for more than 10 years.

Matte screens are harder to clean, sure, but they are healthier for my eyes and my head, both of which I rely on for my living. Color-matching is not a serious issue for me, but seeing my screen instead of my office's reflection is.

Maybe there can be an aftermarket stick-on matte screen?



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I can always degloss
Authored by: DevMac on Oct 15, '08 10:59:02AM
If you have to "think" there maybe an aftermarket stick-on matte screen, you really have to question some of your comments.

There is a difference between reflection and glare.

Certainly refelection can be eliminated by changing the angle of the screen, height of the chair/desktop and/or relocation of your postion relative to the light source.

Glare can be often reduced by simply repositioning the screen so it doesn't reflect off its surface, e.g., place the screen between you and the sun or light source.

You want to reduce eye strain, get a big monitor. Real big.

Owned and worked in graphic studios/agencies for over 20 years. Early days, we customized a lot of hoods until we realized that tilting a screen or adjusting room lighting eliminated the issue. And if you ever worked in that field, 10 to 14-hour days were not out of the norm.

Again, the new bright LED backlit LCDs make a significant difference on reflection. Think about it. Stand in front of a window and the darker the night, the greater the reflection. Stand in front of a window and the brighter the day, the less the reflection.

Great source in any event: http://www.apple.com/about/ergonomics/

http://www.safecomputingtips.com/blog/ergonomic-monitor/how-to-set-up-the-monitor-to-avoid-awkward-postures-and-eyestrain/

http://www.tspinc.com/antiglarevantireflec.html


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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens
Authored by: luigi193 on Oct 15, '08 06:37:56PM

I have no problems and prefer glossy... and will be buying one.
So yeah.



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Poll posted - New MacBook Pros and glossy screens
Authored by: cboyce on Oct 17, '08 09:26:07AM
My black MacBook's glossy screen drove me nuts-- until I bought an anti-glare film from Power Support. It fits perfectly and cuts the glare significantly. I love it. I also bought one that fits my iPhone (original) and I love that one too.

I don't know whether the new MacBooks and MacBook Pros have the same size screens as the older ones. If they do, these films will make the "I want matte" people very happy.

The film either prevents fingerprints or prevents them from being seen, a big big plus on the iPhone. I used to polish the iPhone screen just about every time I used the thing but no more.

A little on the pricey side, or so I thought until I had the films in place.

Here's a link that will take you Power Support's products on Amazon.

http://www.amazon.com/s/qid=1218061436/ref=sr_pg_1?ie=UTF8&rs=172282&rh=n%3A172282%2Cp%5F15%3APower%20Support&page=1


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